Episode 64 - Decolonizing Our Closets & Reconnecting to Earth with Jeanne de Kroon

What if every piece of clothing you wore carried the songs of the women who made it? What if your closet could be a bridge between ancient wisdom and modern consciousness, connecting you not just to global sisterhood, but to your own ancestral roots?

In this profound conversation with Jeanne de Kroon, founder of Zazi Vintage and UN Ethical Fashion Initiative partner, we explore how fashion can become a pathway to healing, both for the planet and for our disconnected relationship with the feminine wisdom of creation. Her journey from modeling in polyester dresses to working with over 1,300 women artisans globally reveals how decolonizing our closets can be an act of revolution, restoration, and deep personal healing.

This isn't just about sustainable fashion. It's about reclaiming the sacred feminine power of creation, honoring the hands that weave our world together, and discovering how even our clothing choices can align with our cyclical nature.

Topics covered

In this episode, we discussed

Jeanne's journey from mainstream modeling to discovering authentic craftsmanship in Nepal
The founding and growth of Zazi Vintage working with 1200+ women globally
Decolonizing fashion and reconnecting to the stories behind our clothing
The energetic difference between natural fibers and synthetic clothing
Working with indigenous communities and traditional textile practices
Himalayan women singing to the Spider Goddess while weaving
The cyclical nature of fashion in harmony with earth's seasons
Reclaiming Dutch and European ancestral wisdom and goddess traditions
Creating altars for ancestors and celebrating seasonal festivals
Fashion industry statistics: 80% women workers, 10% capital ownership
Cyclical dressing through menstrual cycle phases
Sexual and sensual liberation in your thirties

About Jeanne de Kroon

Jeanne de Kroon connects worlds and stories through craftsmanship. She is the founder of Zazi Vintage, partner of the UN Ethical Fashion Initiative, and co-founder of Woven the Foundation. With a background in philosophy and political science, she started her first company at age 22 in Germany, where it was named "Best Fashion Business Idea of the Year" by both Vogue and Harper's Bazaar just after launching.

Working both circularly with natural fibers and with women-led artisanal projects, Zazi Vintage focuses on the environmental and social impact behind the garment industry while weaving the stories of nature and women together. Since 2018, Zazi Vintage has become the main partner of the United Nations Ethical Fashion Initiative across Central Asia and Afghanistan.

Jeanne has led several innovative partnerships in the creative and wellbeing industry that platform ancestral wisdom through craft, and works as a consultant for both governmental bodies and global businesses on respectful co-creation. She has been featured as a storyteller, activist, and thought leader in Vogue, Forbes, TEDx, and The New York Times, among others.

Connect with Jeanne

Listen to the Episode

Timestamps

[00:00:27] Introduction to decolonizing closets and honoring women's craftsmanship

[00:04:51] Jeanne's story: From Dutch upbringing to discovering fashion's disconnection from nature

[00:06:18] The wake-up call: Polyester dress in New York vs. authentic craftsmanship

[00:07:21] Nepal transformation: Woman dressing her in vintage sari and sharing mountain stories

[00:08:58] Meeting MAD and starting the journey with seven women in rural India

[00:12:59] From maker to model: How industrialization shifted focus away from craftspeople

[00:14:45] Working with Himalayan shepherds: Wool, natural dyes, and Spider Goddess songs

[00:17:59] Fashion industry statistics: Women create 80% but own only 10% of capital

[00:22:57] Reclaiming ancestral culture: Black Lives Matter inspiring craft celebration

[00:26:23] Decolonizing Dutch heritage: Discovering European eco-feminist history

[00:30:28] Visiting sacred Dutch sites: Ancestral healing and land connection

[00:43:33] Cyclical dressing: How clothing choices shift through menstrual phases

The Awakening: From Polyester Dreams to Authentic Creation

Jeanne's transformation began with a jarring contrast that many of us can relate to. Growing up in The Hague with an art historian mother and a documentary filmmaker father, she was surrounded by stories and beauty. Yet when she was discovered as a model and flew to New York at 18, reality hit hard.

"I just remember being there in this polyester plastic dress and in a bunk bed without a working visa. And I just remembered like, wow, like this is obviously not the story that I was told. I just felt like I had been so excited for this dream. And then the dream felt so limiting and small, and I've never felt so small."

This moment of disillusionment became the seed of revolution. The gap between the glamorous promise of fashion and the reality of cheap, soulless production sparked a journey that would span continents and transform not just her life, but the lives of hundreds of women artisans worldwide.

The Nepal Revelation

The turning point came in a back alley in Nepal, where a woman looked at Jeanne's "all black techno outfit" and said something that changed everything: "I don't understand, your eyes look like celebration, but what is going on with this outfit?"

That woman dressed her in a vintage 1970s sari and shared stories from the mountains. In that moment, Jeanne saw the magic she'd been seeking:

Authentic beauty rooted in cultural tradition
Rich stories passed down through generations
Profound artistry existing in traditional craftsmanship
Colors, textures, and techniques that honored the earth
Community knowledge preserved in textile creation

"Why isn't this on the cover of the Vogues? Why did I think that the airbrushed girl in the magazine, why did I measure myself to that when actually there's so much magic in the hands of these unseen stories?"

Building Bridges: The Journey from Seven Women to Global Impact

What started with seven women in a mother-in-law's house with a $100 budget has grown into a global network supporting over 1,300 women artisans. Jeanne's partnership with MAD and the Himalayan Women's Project became the foundation for something much larger than fashion:it became a movement of connection and restoration.

"We made these few dresses and then got back to Germany, where I was living at the time. And then this sort of became a thing, and it went from me on the Sunday market with like a few finds to this small baby company that has now led me across the world."

Today, Zazi Vintage partners with women-led rural organizations globally, working with:

Wool weavers and spinners in the Himalayas
Indigenous women's communities in the Amazon
Pastoral families and shepherds across mountain regions
Traditional textile artisans preserving ancient techniques
Women's cooperatives maintaining cultural crafts

But the impact goes far deeper than commerce:it's about honoring the sacred feminine power of creation that has been systematically devalued and hidden.

The Sacred in Every Stitch: Spider Goddess Songs and Himalayan Wool

Perhaps the most moving aspect of Jeanne's work is how it reveals the spiritual dimension of traditional craftsmanship. In the Himalayas, she works with women who collect wool from sheep grazing across mountains, wash it in Himalayan spring waters, create natural dyes from local plants, and then weave while singing songs.

"While they weave, they sing the songs of the Spider Goddess and their ancestral spirit or guardians that are protecting their land as a thank you and as an honor for the creation that they do."

This isn't just about making clothes:it's about honoring multiple layers of creation:

The earth that provides the plants and animals
The seasons that determine natural dye colors
The ancestral wisdom passed through generations
The spiritual guardians protecting the land
The community bonds strengthened through shared creation

Every garment carries the energy of gratitude, the songs of creation, and the blessing of community.

Feeling the Difference in Your Body

"You really feel this, the moment that you are starting to understand the stories of clothing and also really have, there's this different sense when you walk in, like a natural, like an old-grown forest, like it does something different to your nervous system. And the same thing is with when you wear something that is of organic materials and that is made in harmony with the community."

This isn't mystical thinking: it's embodied truth. When we wear clothing made with love, intention, and respect for the earth, our bodies respond differently. We can feel the difference between synthetic extraction and organic creation.

The Hidden Truth: Women's Invisible Labor in Fashion

The statistics Jeanne shares are staggering and revealing: "The global fashion industry is worth $2.4 trillion. Around 80% of the people that make fashion, sell fashion by fashion, are women. And we only own 10% of global capital within the fashion industry."

Fashion is a women's industry where women's stories are systematically erased. We see the model, not the maker. We know the designer, not the weaver. We celebrate the brand, not the hands that sang while stitching.

"It is a women's industry, although the women's stories and actually like where it has come from, both the mother Earth and the creators behind it are shadowed. We don't see that."

This invisibility isn't accidental—it's part of a larger pattern of devaluing feminine creation that includes:

Erasing the stories of the actual makers
Focusing on consumption rather than creation
Prioritizing speed and profit over craftsmanship
Disconnecting products from their earth origins
Undervaluing traditional knowledge and skills
Hiding the true environmental and social costs

This extends far beyond fashion into how we relate to the earth, to nurturing, to the cyclical wisdom that has sustained humanity for millennia.

Reclaiming Cultural Pride: Beyond Colonial Narratives

One of the most powerful shifts Jeanne has witnessed is the reclamation of cultural pride in traditional craftsmanship. She notes how movements like Black Lives Matter have sparked not just diversity in magazines, but "the reclamation of ancestral cultures for so many people that have felt lost in the one-sided narrative."

"When I'm in India right now, there is such an incredible wave of the reclamation of culture and diversity happening. When the makers understand like, oh, my craft or my story is not something of an old world. It's actually very, it is what we already feel like it's the most important thing to safeguard right now."

This cultural reclamation creates a beautiful pride cycle: When traditional crafts are celebrated rather than dismissed as "old world," artisans rediscover the value and relevance of their ancestral knowledge. Their work isn't just surviving—it's thriving as the medicine our disconnected world desperately needs.

Healing European Ancestral Disconnection

Perhaps the most personal part of Jeanne's journey has been discovering that decolonization includes healing her own ancestral disconnection. After spending years learning from cultures around the world, she realized she needed to reclaim her own Dutch heritage.

"For a long time, I've always just thought like, okay, great. All of these amazing women that I work with have these stories of culture, of land. But like, what am I? I'm just a descendant of the people who brought all the problems to the world. Like, what are the women from my land? Didn't they sing songs?"

Her research into European eco-feminist history revealed profound truths about pre-patriarchal traditions:

European women once had nature-based cosmologies
They sang songs to the land and seasonal cycles
They lived in harmony with earth rhythms
They practiced animism and earth-based spirituality
They held wisdom about plants, healing, and community
They were systematically persecuted during witch hunts
Their knowledge was deliberately suppressed and forgotten

Before 4,000 years of patriarchy and the colonialism that followed, European women also carried the sacred feminine wisdom that still thrives in other parts of the world.

Sacred Site Pilgrimage

"I went to visit all of these old sacred sites of the Netherlands, and I would sit on these old burial hills, and I would meditat,e and I would ask for support. It was like I would wake up in the middle of the night and have tears coming through me. It just felt like every cell in my body was coming home."

This ancestral healing work has practical implications for conscious living:

Understanding our own cultural wounding helps us heal
Knowing our roots allows authentic global collaboration
Healing guilt enables respectful cultural exchange
Reclaiming our wisdom prevents appropriation of others
Grounding in our land supports sustainable practices
Connecting to ancestors guides ethical choices

When we understand our own cultural history and healing, we can relate to other cultures from authenticity rather than guilt or appropriation.

Cyclical Dressing: Fashion as Expression of Feminine Rhythms

In a delightful exploration of how clothing choices shift with menstrual cycles, Jeanne reveals how her wardrobe becomes an expression of her cyclical nature:

Premenstrual phase: "I just wear my darker colors. So I think my friends now know that when I'm in brown or darker colors, I'm premenstrual 'cause otherwise this never happens."

Menstrual phase: "The moment I have my moon is actually great. It's like a celebration. So then I would wear reds and feel like a little bit of a witchy lady. So I like to wear dresses."

Follicular phase: "Then like the cute little belly tops come out and like the low waist jeans and then I feel very cute and I am in more colors again."

This cyclical approach to dressing honors the natural rhythms of feminine energy rather than forcing ourselves into static style choices. It's another way that conscious fashion can support our connection to our cyclical nature.

Key Takeaways

Fashion was once earth-connected and women-centered before industrialization shifted focus from maker to model
80% of fashion workers are women, but women own only 10% of industry capital - revealing systematic devaluation of feminine labor
Traditional crafts carry spiritual energy through songs, ceremonies, and earth-based materials
Cultural reclamation is happening globally as communities rediscover pride in ancestral wisdom
Decolonizing includes healing European ancestral disconnection and reclaiming pre-patriarchal earth wisdom
Sacred sites and ancestral healing can restore connection to land-based spirituality
Clothing choices can honor cyclical rhythms by shifting with menstrual phases
Every garment tells a story of either extraction or creation, disconnection or community
Sustainable fashion is about connection, not just environment - healing the relationship between human and earth
Women's hands have always been the weavers of worlds - from fabric to community to wisdom transmission
Local rootedness enables global collaboration - knowing your own land helps relate authentically to others
Small actions create big changes - seven women with $100 became a global movement

Transcript

[00:00:00] Iris Josephina: This was such a beautiful, nourishing podcast episode. I had the honor to sit down with Jeanne de Kroon, who is the founder of Zazi Vintage, and we spoke about so many topics that are so close to my heart. We spoke about decolonizing our closet, honoring sustainability and honesty in fashion and authenticity.

[00:00:27] Iris Josephina: We talked about reconnecting to the earth. We talked about the power of women supporting women and honoring the craftmanship that has belonged to women's hands throughout history. We spoke about reclaiming our history and our rootedness and the soil of our land that is the Netherlands and the goddesses that

[00:00:52] Iris Josephina: go with that. We spoke about eco feminism. We spoke about just clothing in general and what that means for us, the energetics of clothing, the clothing that we like in the phases of our cycle and just in general. This was a beautiful get together sister to sister conversation that we would love to share with you.

[00:01:17] Iris Josephina: For those of you who don't know Jeanne, let me introduce her to you. Jeanne de Kroon Deron connects worlds and stories through craftsmanship. Jeanne is the founder of Zazi, vintage partner of the UN Ethical Fashion Initiative and woven the foundation. With a background in philosophy and political science. She started her first company at the age of 22 in Germany where it was named, best fashion business Idea of the Year by both Vogue and Harpers Bazaar just after launching. Working both circular with natural fibers and with women's LED artisanal projects, Zazi Vintage focuses on environmental and social impact behind the garment industry while weaving the stories of nature and women together.

[00:02:00] Iris Josephina: Since 2018, Saudi Vintage has become the main partner of the United Nations Ethical Fashion Initiative across Central Asia and Afghanistan. The UN EFI is a joint venture of the UN and WTO that works at the intersection of international development, the creative industries, and the fashion and lifestyle sector offering sustainability services, products, and developmental projects.

[00:02:23] Iris Josephina: Jeanne has led several innovative partnerships in the creative and wellbeing industry that platform ancestral wisdom through K Craft, and works as a consultant for both governmental bodies and global businesses on respectful co-creation. She has been featured as a storyteller, activist, and thought leader in Vogue, Forbes, TEDx faz, and The New York Times, among others.

[00:02:48] Iris Josephina: Without further ado. Let's dive in, and I hope that you all feel nourished and inspired by our conversation, but especially Jeanne's story. Enjoy listening.

[00:03:05] Iris Josephina: You are listening to the podcast of Iris Josephina. If you are passionate about exploring the menstrual cycle, cyclical living body wisdom, personal growth, spirituality, and running a business in alignment with your natural cycles, you're in the right place. I'm Iris. I'm an entrepreneur, functional hormone specialist, trainer and coach, and I am on a mission to share insights, fun facts, and inspiration I discover along the way as I run my business and walk my own path on earth.

[00:03:36] Iris Josephina: Here you'll hear my personal stories, guest interviews and vulnerable shares from clients and students. Most people know me from Instagram where you can find me under at cycle seeds, or they have been a coaching client or student in one of my courses. I'm so grateful you're here. Let's dive into today's episode.

[00:03:57] Iris Josephina: Okay, welcome everyone to a new episode. Today, I have the beautiful Jeanne with me and I am really, excited that you're here with us today. Welcome to the show.

[00:04:12] Jeanne de Kroon: Thank you so much. I'm so excited to be here and I feel like we've had this planned for a long time and it feels like the right time. We're entering this new phase, also very much in my life, so I'm just very excited to Yeah, connect at this moment and, with your beautiful community.

[00:04:29] Iris Josephina: Yeah. So for those of you who don't know you, could you share a little, like brief snippet of your story? The people will have heard your introduction at the beginning of the podcast, but I'm curious whether you could just talk a little bit about your unique story and what you do on this planet.

[00:04:51] Jeanne de Kroon: Yeah, so I'm Dutch. I grew up in a city called The Hague, and my father was a documentary maker about the magic of the Dutch light, and my mom was an art historian and a fashion journalist. So I always grew up with like a lot of like, seeing the stories beyond like the sort of the material world.

[00:05:12] Jeanne de Kroon: And I think this, sort of just like this, way of looking at the world has always really enchanted me throughout my entire childhood. Although there were also many heartbreaks in there and difficult moments It felt like I was always looking for this. yeah, the magic of life without having the words yet, because I feel like, I grew up in also such a limited culture that sort of like, really like repressed both my own magic and like the perspectives on it.

[00:05:36] Jeanne de Kroon: And then when I was 17, I lived alone since I was 15 and then I, when I was 17, I moved out of, the house. I ended up in Paris and there I got discovered as a model. So I flew to New York when I was just 18 and it was really interesting 'cause I, I think you have this very preconditioned idea, Noah, when you're a young girl, and especially when you grow up with like modern media

[00:06:00] Jeanne de Kroon: that time or like mainstream media. So I had this whole incredible like, idea of just like, wow, I'm going to like me and my mom would like geek out on specific silks and like, like the intricacy of small embroidery. And I just remember being there in this like polyester plastic dress and in a bunk bed without a working visa.

[00:06:18] Jeanne de Kroon: And I just remembered like, wow, like this is obviously not the story that I was told. And I, just remember what it felt like in my body. Like I just felt like I had been so excited for this dream. And then the dream felt so limiting and small and I've never felt so small. I was also going through a very difficult time in my life working through trauma,

[00:06:40] Jeanne de Kroon: ended up in Berlin in I think, yeah, when I was just 19 and got very lost there. and then at the, to the point where I just like didn't really understand, 'cause the, life felt so, so limiting and so I knew that I didn't belong on like, the path people around me had.

[00:06:59] Jeanne de Kroon: And I also really didn't know what my own path was. And then I remembered I got to this, I, booked a ticket to Nepal and there was this really beautiful woman in a little back alley. And she looked at me in my, like all black like, techno outfit. And she just looked at me and she was just like, I don't understand, your eyes look like celebration, but what is going on with this outfit?

[00:07:21] Jeanne de Kroon: And then she dressed me in this incredible old, like, I think it was like a 1970s s and she told me about stories from her, from the mountains. And then I just remembered and I looked around me and I saw all of the beautiful colors and the smiles and the sense, I think. It was the first time that I was just like, wow.

[00:07:40] Jeanne de Kroon: like, why isn't this on the cover of the Vogues? Like, why? Why did I think that like the, the airbrushed girl in the magazine, why did I measure myself to that when actually there's so much magic in like the hands of these sort of like unseen stories at that time?

[00:07:56] Jeanne de Kroon: Because that was also very much the time before, we started talking about decolonization in the global debate and I, I grew up in the Netherlands, so had a very limited view, but I just felt this very deeply in like all of themselves. So I think in that's always been the red thread of my life.

[00:08:14] Jeanne de Kroon: I come from a weaving family myself. Like my last name is a part of a 17th century weaving machine from the north of the Netherlands. So I, this is, I think, what has pulled me across the world from the smallest villages in the Amazon to the highest mountains of Tajikistan. I think I have been.

[00:08:35] Jeanne de Kroon: Enchanted myself and inspired and awakened and activated by the stories of women, in what we, so often you like disregard like, oh, some cute, like, craft project. But I actually just felt like, I don't know, it felt like that there was this, sort of cosmic thing that was calling through these tiny stitches and like the songs that the women would sing.

[00:08:58] Jeanne de Kroon: but I was also student, so just like, I was like feeling all the feelings, but also just like, where do you start with when you're a student, and you're trying to fit yourself into this, into the narratives that you're told and also like, are trying to liberate yourself from it. And I was studying philosophy at the time, political science, and then I think at some, yeah, no, not I think, but at some point I met this incredible woman called MAD who runs the.

[00:09:23] Jeanne de Kroon: So Haley Women's Project, I met her when she was just starting out. I think she had gathered like seven women in the house of her mother-in-law. She had like a super small starting budget of a hundred dollars. and I just remembered like I, we were introduced during one of my travels. And I said with her in the car and she was just like, Jan, I really if we wanna work together, you have to become a fashion designer.

[00:09:48] Jeanne de Kroon: and then I spent the two months there, with her family and connecting to the women ever of the village. And I think I was just like, I'm not the fashion designer obviously, but they are, it was just so beautiful to see, to learn, to sit together, to have giggle, to have chai.

[00:10:03] Jeanne de Kroon: and we made these few dresses and then got back to Germany, where I was living at the time. And then this sort of became a thing and it went from me on the Sunday market with like a few fines to this small baby company that has now led me across the world. And we work, I think now with, Must be around like 12 to 1300 women in, globally. we have a small team in Amsterdam. We partner only with women's led rural organizations. So from like wool weavers and spin spinners and the Himalayas to indigenous women's communities in the Amazon, to really co-create, garments.

[00:10:41] Jeanne de Kroon: And this is, for me, it's, it reaches so much further than sustainability. 'cause I feel like, we're not necessarily in a climate crisis, we're in a connection crisis. And I think that intersects so much on the feminine. And I think it's. yeah, that's has become my main intentionality of life to rediscover, like what happens when women come together and create and try to create these little ecosystems that can hopefully mimic what, is needed globally for us, as a humankind to come back to creation that is in harmony with nature, with community and based on reciprocity.

[00:11:19] Iris Josephina: Wow. That's really beautiful. Thank you so much for sharing your stories of so vulnerably and how you went from the. Like, almost like dark mainstream fashion world to this really authentic way of engaging with people with fabrics, with land. I'm just endlessly inspired by you and how you weave all of that together and how amazing it must feel that.

[00:11:54] Iris Josephina: This has grown so big and there are so many women on this planet that are supported by the company that you founded and how they can really keep their craft alive and share their skill. This is just, yeah, really, beautiful. How do you feel that this kind of connectivity or connection and community can also help us reconnecting to the earth because of course, all of the fabrics that are used in the garments that all these women create, they're not just pulled from, from inorganic substance, they come from the earth, right?

[00:12:40] Jeanne de Kroon: Yeah. Yeah. It's so interesting now because I think like we're because essentially like what we call the fashion industry now has once come from just women in their home creating from land, from local nature. Like essentially you could trace back any, garment to the local region.

[00:12:59] Jeanne de Kroon: The biodiversity, like the layers of nature and like the culture that. That was in relationship to it. And it's, and that at some point, I think through industrialization and, globalization we have, like, because of the patriarchal system, we have shifted the gaze from the maker to the model.

[00:13:18] Jeanne de Kroon: And also therefore really like took away our took away our connection to it because essentially like every time we're connecting now to fashion, not every time, but most times we're actually connecting to a created story and not the story where it actually comes from. just like in small things, like of course when you see a dress, I don't know, on Instagram or social media or like in a magazine, like it's very rare that you actually see the story of the clothing.

[00:13:45] Jeanne de Kroon: It's always like, it's a creation from a designer from the global north. And it's made somewhere from, let's say, like polyester all comes from, petroleum. So from oil. So it's like pulled, extractive from the ground in places where, yeah, mostly indigenous communities live and the most vulnerable.

[00:14:03] Jeanne de Kroon: And it's just like masked in this very glamorous way. Whereas, and I think, essentially, and I think this is something that I even, you know, like still every single season I learn more and there are more layers that are coming to the surface. So for me, like starting sassy, because I didn't have really have any pressure when I started it.

[00:14:21] Jeanne de Kroon: And I think even now, like I still don't have investors. So it is for me, like every single, I don't know, I would, yeah. Almost like season that we do, it feels like I am reminded of the cyclical nature of earth. because when you actually work in harmony with earth, like we work with this incredible women's organization, for example, in the Himalayas, and they work with over 250 pastoral families and shepherd.

[00:14:45] Jeanne de Kroon: So they collect, like when the sheep graze over the mountains, like during the whole season with the local shepherds, they collect the wool, they wash it into Himalayan spring waters, and then they look at the local nature and at the seasons that are there, and they like from, let's say, the plants or the earth or the little walnuts that come from the trees, from the organic material, they create the natural dyes.

[00:15:10] Jeanne de Kroon: and then while they weave. They sing the songs of the Spider Goddess and their, ancestral sort of, spirit or, like guardians that are protecting their land as a thank you and as like an honoring, for the creation that they do. And I was just like, and then you feel like what this sort of does when it, when you put it over your body, like I think this is also so interesting, like we've so long put ourselves aside from nature, although we are nature and you really feel this, the moment that you are starting to understand the stories of clothing and also really have, there's this.

[00:15:44] Jeanne de Kroon: Different sense when you walk in like a, natural, like, like an old grown forest, like does something different to your nervous system. And the same thing is with when you wear something that is of organic materials and that is made in like, in harmony and, with community.

[00:16:01] Jeanne de Kroon: yeah, I think it, it has been teaching me so much and this is, like we just so often don't see like, for like a little, just first you need to have like the tiny little cotton seed and then you have to plant it. Then it can only harvest normally like naturally. One time, we have these unnatural cycles of like four times now that are depleting the land.

[00:16:20] Jeanne de Kroon: But when you really do it, it's one time and then you imagine the farmers, that are, that are working with the lands throughout the season that are collecting it and harvesting it from the small little flowers and then like weaving it and spinning it with like, with these incredible little tools.

[00:16:36] Jeanne de Kroon: And by the time you even have the cotton and not even like the dyeing or the, or, the embroidering or the, stitching. I think it just made me understand so much that everything that. That we, have around us is, a product of creation, and it tells a story of our relationship to it.

[00:16:56] Jeanne de Kroon: yeah, I think it has, it, really has inspired me on so many levels and even like having my own little garden at some point, I, adopted these very cute little rescue hens and I just was just so fascinated by the first egg they made as well. So I was just like, wow, you made this in your belly, And it was such a simple thing, but I think because I understood that little chicken and her personality and then I saw this little egg and I was just like, wow. And now I cannot see an egg anymore without thinking of like, which cute little fluffy lady made it. And I cannot see a garment. Without thinking like, wow, like who made this?

[00:17:33] Jeanne de Kroon: Like what are her dreams? What are her wishes? What is her story like? I just imagining, most, or mostly I just imagine like a, beautiful mother because it is mostly mothers now. It's like the global fashion world. I think now the global fashion industry, it's worth $2.4 trillion. around 80% of the, people that make fashion, sell fashion by fashion, are women.

[00:17:59] Jeanne de Kroon: And we only own 10% of global capital within the fashion industry. And around like in places like India, like 8% of land used. So it is a women's. Industry, although the women's stories and actually like where it has come from, both the mother Earth and the, creators behind it are, they're shadowed. like we don't see that. And I think it's been really interesting within my own business and within my own journey, is how to create new structures that can actually honor that feminine essence of creation.

[00:18:34] Iris Josephina: Oh, that's really beautiful. It actually made me emotional when you were sharing about the women in India honoring the land and giving thanks to the land while they're like weaving and, working the, clothes with their craftmanship or craft woman ship.

[00:18:54] Jeanne de Kroon: Yeah.

[00:18:54] Iris Josephina: Yeah, it's, really beautiful how there was a story in every stitch of the fabric. And I think many people don't even think about that. And then to take it a step further, how I feel it when, for example, I have like a piece of clothing that comes from like the fast fashion mainstream world.

[00:19:15] Iris Josephina: Yeah. I feel it in my body when I've wear, when I've worn, for example, like a, an organic Marino wool shirt or a sweater that I know is made sustainably and ethically and with so much love and care, I literally feel that in my body, like how my body responds to it. And I think many people are not very aware of it. But I also feel like what you said earlier is that we lost connection with that. If I remember the stories of my grandmother, they were making their own clothes. Yes. They spend time doing that. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:19:56] Jeanne de Kroon: It's crazy. It's like really within like two generations we've lost it. No, and it's really interesting, like, 'cause the same thing with me.

[00:20:03] Jeanne de Kroon: Even like when I look at my mother, like she's still really like brought things to Taylor. Like, I think, when she was, she's, I think in her late sixties now, but she, she has such a different relationship than I grew up. Or the people you know, from generation before me grew up with fashion.

[00:20:19] Jeanne de Kroon: 'cause we come in such a, like the, like this Yeah, just fast fashion that you can throw away that works within this like, crazy attention spam of, of two seconds. And then it's worked. It's like based upon trends and it's really interesting. It really like the, it's. Just like phenomenal to see the, change within a few generations.

[00:20:39] Jeanne de Kroon: Just like when I listened to my mom and my grandmother, they were still eating organic food now. So it's really like the, real like repression of nature, I feel like has been such a product of the, last, I don't know, 50, 60 years.

[00:20:53] Iris Josephina: Yeah. And then at the same time parallel to that there are communities in the world where the, these beautiful crafts are sustained.

[00:21:05] Iris Josephina: Yeah. And where people are working so hard and with so much dedication to sustain and maintain this, do you feel sometimes on your travels that, That people like want to shift. I remember when I was in the Colombian Amazon Uhhuh, like 10 years ago, that people were like in this dilemma. Like they, they were very much into like, oh, we need to like sustain these crafts, but then I also want what you have. I want to wear what you're wearing and how have you, how have you observed that on your travels?

[00:21:44] Jeanne de Kroon: Yeah, it's really interesting 'cause I think, like the sort of the colonization and the

[00:21:49] Jeanne de Kroon: industrialization and also like of media, especially in, countries in the global North has been very present. Like this has been like I've, seen this in so many different communities. They're just, but I also really notice, 'cause we do work with the communities that are. That are, that really want to safeguard the craft.

[00:22:08] Jeanne de Kroon: and mostly it's the mothers and the older women in the, like really like the elders in the village. Like for example, in the Mulian Village, there's just, I think there are just one or two elders left that know how to work with the really old weaving tool. So it's mostly the younger generations that are of, course, like growing up with more like model media.

[00:22:25] Jeanne de Kroon: And they're like, but wait a minute. Like I want to be, like in the, let's say like I want to wear the Bollywood, like the Bollywood stars outfits, but then I do really notice, and I think this is what has really shifted. I remember when Black Lives Matter happened and I, was just, I was really hoping, like, wow, I really hope that this is not just the start of like more diversity on the magazine front pages, but I also really hope that this can become this start of like the reclamation ancestral cultures for so many people that have felt lost in the.

[00:22:57] Jeanne de Kroon: One-sided narrative. And I feel like when I'm in India right now, like there is such an incredible like, wave of the reclamation of culture and diversity happening. That also sparks like back through in media like we, when we did the last collaboration, like we had this incredible article by Vogue India that like celebrated the craft from the Himalayas and, they're doing such an incredible job at really like refocusing the shift back onto the makers.

[00:23:25] Jeanne de Kroon: and I think this is also, this works in like a both, both ways that I feel like a lot of the makers when they understand like, oh, like my, craft or my story is not, something of an old world. It's actually. Very, it's the most, it's, it is what we already feel like it's the most, important thing to safeguard right now.

[00:23:44] Jeanne de Kroon: It's also that there is this incredible pride that comes back. so yeah, it's a, it's definitely there and it really depends per region of what I've seen. 'cause also a hundred percent, like I even noticed this with some of the amazing like indigenous women's communities that are living next to.

[00:24:02] Jeanne de Kroon: These villages that are highly colonized by, the agri, agri businesses and that have like really cheap or imported things from, let's say China. because there is like really intense Chinese market penetration and these tiny little villages in the Amazon where you're just like, wow.

[00:24:18] Jeanne de Kroon: How did these, like, like fluorescent Christmas lights ended up in like a small village next to the Amazon basin. So there's definitely this sort of like, especially from, local communities there, at least this is what I've learned from a lot of like my, indigenous activist friends and indigenous friends there, that there is this,

[00:24:37] Jeanne de Kroon: Yeah, that there is also locally a lot of, disapproval of the, of the indigenous ways just shaped by media, but also even like in those areas, I do notice like there has been just such a strong movement, whether it's in Brazil with the indigenous peoples that I've been mostly connected to or whether it's in, in, in, in Ian Himalayas.

[00:24:57] Jeanne de Kroon: I feel like there's such a. Strong force right now that is like beyond what we can really grasp. That is on its way to find more connection and reclamation. And I think even also within myself, I think, Like decolonizing my own perspective of what it meant to be Dutch has been very powerful. 'cause I think for a long time I've always just thought like, okay, great.

[00:25:19] Jeanne de Kroon: like all of these like amazing women that I work with, they have these stories of culture, of land. Like I can sit with the elders to learn about the songs that they sing, for the little plants that come up in the seasons. But like, what am I, like, I'm just like a, I'm just like a, I don't know.

[00:25:36] Jeanne de Kroon: Like I'm a, sort of like, I'm a descendant of like the people that brought all the problems to the world. Like, like don't, like what are the women from my lab? Didn't they sing songs? Like We Have Nature and Little Bit still, but once, very much so I think. I think also even for myself, I've been, through my discovery of just what the feminine means within, like the avatar that I got from his lifetime from the Netherlands.

[00:26:02] Jeanne de Kroon: Like, what are the stories there? And I think it's, that's also been just a really powerful journey to reconnect back to, my ancestral wisdom. So I've spent the last, I don't know, I think like two years just researching like decolonizing, yeah, European history and looking at that from like an eco feminist perspective.

[00:26:23] Jeanne de Kroon: Seeing how the system of 4,000 years of patriarchy and like the, like how colonialism started and how it's so much a story of intergenerational trauma and that the women from my land also sang songs and also had a cosmology that was based on, animism and nature based Yeah. Religion. so I think.

[00:26:45] Jeanne de Kroon: What I'm noticing is like, and I think that's been such an inspiration to work with these communities, for me to go on this discovery course of like, of the global story of. Feminine and the re repression of the feminine.

[00:27:02] Iris Josephina: Yeah. I, love that. My background is in anthropology, so my, heart just beats faster when I hear you talk about this, because I've been on like a similar, journey.

[00:27:15] Iris Josephina: Like I have found myself like traveling the world for most of my twenties and eventually realizing like, hold on a minute, like why am I constantly like running away from my roots in the Netherlands? Like, isn't there also magic in that land and how far do I have to look back like pre-Christian times to find, what I'm so desperately looking for in other places where they have been able to sustain and maintain.

[00:27:44] Iris Josephina: These types of cosmology is better than where we're from because of the past that we've had in our country and patriarchy and witch hunts and all the terrible stories of Europe that you are well aware of.

[00:27:57] Iris Josephina: And I think there is so much healing. And magic in going back to our roots, like in our own bodies, but also in the, like on the earth, the land that we grew up in, where our roots lay and I think you, you're also familiar with the work of Naomi Fre, right?

[00:28:20] Jeanne de Kroon: Oh yeah. She's so cute. Yeah. I really like her. Yeah, I went through a session with her and we've always kept in contact. I really, admire her. But yeah. Tell me what, have you connected with her on?

[00:28:32] Iris Josephina: she is now offering a course that I'm doing, it's called Spirit Weavers, or Wisdom Weavers.

[00:28:38] Iris Josephina: Wisdom Weavers. Yeah. And, It is exactly about that. It's about finding your roots in the Netherlands and, the, all the goddesses of the Netherlands, like FRA and Ana and a Yeah. It's really cool and

[00:28:56] Jeanne de Kroon: whoa,

[00:28:57] Iris Josephina: I

[00:28:57] Jeanne de Kroon: didn't know. That's so exciting. Yeah. No, and I think this is so important because I think it, like it really gives this extra layer of belonging that.

[00:29:06] Jeanne de Kroon: I think so many women around me are looking for, and I think this was also for me, I think just like I'm so grateful to have learned from, the, philosophy of yoga and like, to work with different cultures and women, but I think we can only really relate. So much better from a place of like authenticity when we start to understand our own story.

[00:29:27] Jeanne de Kroon: Yeah. And not from a place of guilt because this is in the end, or shame because this is really what I believe is like the lowest frequency. But really to come from a place of like, okay, so what is, what are all of these multilayered. Stories that are, present in, in my, culture and like what?

[00:29:43] Jeanne de Kroon: Like both the good and the ugly and like to understand that there is so much magic. And I'm really excited too. This is why I moved back to the Netherlands after being abroad for 10 years because I was really longing for this. And I think the last three years has been such a profound healing. not just in, within my own family system, also with my family, with my mom, with my grandmother that's in the spirit world, but also, yeah. I went to visit all of these old sacred sites of the Netherlands at some point, like last winter, and I like went there with, my little like tools and I would sit on these old, like burial hills and I would, meditate and I would ask for support and like, it was so magical. It was like I would wake up in the middle of the night and have tears coming through me.

[00:30:28] Jeanne de Kroon: Wow. It just felt like every cell in my body was coming home. and I could sense the grief and the fear, but also the expansion and the power. And I sometimes, like in moments now, I know also how to call up on my ancestors and I feel like the Dutch wise women in the spirits of the land when I need support and then the lands learns to speak to me too.

[00:30:52] Jeanne de Kroon: And I think that's been such a magical thing. I think it's like, while we all have this sort of creator power as women and also as humans in general too. To be able to connect deeper. Like the more that we ground and the more that we ground both towards the ground and towards the sky. I think also the more that, we can talk with the natural world and life and and it becomes more of a dance.

[00:31:16] Jeanne de Kroon: And, yeah, I think, yeah, just very passionate about this, but I'm like, so not there yet, but I feel like I'm just embarking on probably a journey that's gonna like continue the rest of my life. On really what it means to, to create, to, connect from my roots, and also to see myself like beyond my roots as a, like a spiritual being, having a human experience.

[00:31:39] Jeanne de Kroon: and I think that's also the thing, like spirit, like, it translates through the material world, but it doesn't really have a face or a name. It's just a thing that moves through us.

[00:31:51] Iris Josephina: Yeah, I totally agree. And when you said spirit, I saw like spirit infusing the fabrics that are made by these women as well.

[00:32:00] Jeanne de Kroon: Yes, me too. I feel this so much and so deeply, like this is why I can get so emotional with like a little piece of, I dunno, like vintage textile. I just feel the spirit in it. Just like I can, yeah. I can feel, just. When, like there's a beautiful meal that's homemade and like grown by farmers in the area, or like, I think this is something that, like as I think spirituality has, I think it, it's very much about self and understanding self in the world.

[00:32:26] Jeanne de Kroon: But I think for me it's so much more about like, it's about service, it's about listening, it's about, and then using our like material bodies to activate something in the world, like our gifts that we have to offer. What did I wanna say with this? Yeah, no spirits of the fabrics too. Sorry, I'm going into things.

[00:32:46] Iris Josephina: That's okay. and I wanted to ask you maybe for people who are getting inspired and who are maybe in the Netherlands right in now, is there any way that you have, or, that you wish be able to share like a tip, like where to start, when you want to connect with. Either the land or fabric.

[00:33:11] Jeanne de Kroon: Yeah, many.

[00:33:12] Jeanne de Kroon: so I am not an expert, but I think what was what really helped me is I, think I made a little altar for, with my both, like maternal, not maternal, both, my grandmothers on top of it with like the seasonal flowers and I gave the little offering, you can cook them like their favorite meals or like give them a little cute little chocolate and like collect flowers that speak to you in some way that are in bloom in the season.

[00:33:37] Jeanne de Kroon: And I think just doing a little meditation or like a moment of gratefulness, I feel like there is so much that wants to run through us, but just like, because we don't have practices or we haven't really learned how to cultivate practices that honor, like the spiritual world of our culture is, this is something that really has helped me.

[00:33:57] Jeanne de Kroon: and then just learning more about, like the, like the old, Or like the Dutch ancestral or the German Germanic traditions, like what goddesses were on the land or what goddesses were honored on specific days. And I do really try to celebrate like all of the, days now. So whether it's like soine or it's yeah.

[00:34:15] Jeanne de Kroon: What else is belt tan? You have all of these like sort of ancestral days of celebration. And whether it's something small or small, something big, like, making a little altar, collecting some flowers or planting something. I think it's really in these small things that, that we can learn so much to, to reconnect to nature.

[00:34:33] Jeanne de Kroon: and then what else has really supported me with textiles, and this was actually amazing. I remember I have this really incredible friend that I made just at the beginning of the lockdown. His name is De Johannes. And he has this really amazing, like online, not online, yeah. Online series that is about like old ancestral Dutch costumes.

[00:34:53] Jeanne de Kroon: Oh, wow. He's like, we this week traveled all across the Midlands. To find like the textiles and the stories and the old ladies with very cute little heads that were still practicing the, these, old traditions of the Netherlands. And he took me to Marca, which is this small village in the north of the Netherlands where I'm, I'm from like Reia, but it's quite close.

[00:35:14] Jeanne de Kroon: And it was, we went there to the, with, to the costume museum and I was like, I have no idea that this was all there. like this, that we also, like, just like other cultures that I've been working with have been getting to learn from, we had different stitches for different wishes and like when mothers, when their daughters got married, they would embroider like a certain piece of cloth for X amount of months or days.

[00:35:38] Jeanne de Kroon: like that you wear something different with for every moment in life that you're in or have little birds that mimic the birds, or like the little swallows or, it was just so fascinating with like certain stitches that carried certain meaning. But this was all still there and it's just like, like, I dunno, it's like a really, like a sub hobby in the Netherlands.

[00:35:59] Jeanne de Kroon: Like it's a really specific little world. But then I got in it and I was like, wow, like we have it too. And then understanding. So that was amazing. like when it comes to like more ancestral Dutch textiles and, but they're also relatively recent notice, I think. Yeah, I think it's been for me, just like, and then visiting, for example, you have this book called Hayden's and you have different, oh, I have that book.

[00:36:25] Jeanne de Kroon: Yeah. I love this. I remember. And then I just like was, I think like last year was reading like the great cosmic mother and like there was this other Sylvia, I think, ah, and like. On like the sort of like the repression of the feminine, how that links to, colonization. Also the start of capitalism and feudalism and all of these.

[00:36:44] Jeanne de Kroon: It's more like, it's very brainy. But I was reading Great Cosmic Matter, Hy Derland and then this woman on witchcraft and I just remember, I like just felt so many feelings. I would sit in the bathtub and just feel like, oh my God, like this feeling in my body and even. Yeah, even like even understanding what happened to the women from my own family.

[00:37:07] Iris Josephina: I

[00:37:07] Jeanne de Kroon: think this is something that was, and still like even last week I found something out that there was a, yeah there that there was a great grandmother that was locked up in a men mental institution. oh my God. Confused to do that probably, I don't know, because she refused to be in this old traditional village in the Netherlands and I think I was just like, got shivers all over my spine and I was like, wow, like women were only.

[00:37:31] Jeanne de Kroon: Seen as normal citizens in 1957, I think. And we have like, although it feels right now, like we really stand here, I think in this generation on top of so many. Women that have fought so hard within their beings to liberate themselves from, yeah. Like the, past generations. So I think also understanding that understanding, I think for me, like connecting more to my voice and also, like I think trauma is really storaged in the womb.

[00:38:06] Jeanne de Kroon: not all trauma, but a lot of trauma that, that women's storage in their womb, like is passed down through generations. So I think also starting to really reconnect to my womb and to, and then reconnecting to my voice, reconnecting to my breath in a deeper way within my whole nervous system has also brought up a lot of like, Yes, like the repression of the feminine within my, or like the trauma that the feminine has storage within my sort of like maternal lineage. So I think it's, it's multi-layered. It's like the big story, but it's also the small story, not the like, it's the inner and the outer world.

[00:38:43] Jeanne de Kroon: It's the,

[00:38:44] Iris Josephina: yeah.

[00:38:44] Jeanne de Kroon: I think this is something that also, I have this amazing friend, she's a Mayan womb healer. She comes from her lineage of family. Like all of the women in her family are Mayan, are like Mayan healers. And she also just said, like sometimes we look so far in like across all the world for answers and.

[00:39:02] Jeanne de Kroon: And other sacred medicines that are, that are not linked to our, culture. Although we can find so many answers just in stillness, reconnecting to our own bodies, our own families. and I think this is really what has, yeah, really inspired me like the power and, the medicine of just like, of inquiry within my own, body.

[00:39:25] Jeanne de Kroon: What is storage there? What, stories are storage there? And, yeah, that's a process that's, I think forever unfolding. very excited.

[00:39:34] Iris Josephina: so beautiful. Thank you for sharing that. And I completely agree with you, like sometimes. The wisest thing to do is come back to the body and to the land and the nature around us. I recently heard this, podcast, I can't remember who said it, but she said. It's sometimes good to just spend time knowing what is in a five kilometer radius around you and your body and that's it.

[00:40:08] Iris Josephina: Yeah. To just like learn about what's going on around you. And I was like, I don't even know what are the native plans around me, like in a radius of, five kilometers. I don't even know that I, have no idea.

[00:40:22] Jeanne de Kroon: Yeah, this is, I think this is for me, like what really activism is. I think it's for me like the, like activism and like what, like how you really can I don't know, like, like transform the world really starts in what's in your own body.

[00:40:37] Jeanne de Kroon: What is storage there, like what is in your direct surround and how can you have an impact there. I think often we look at. All of these stories to think through, like media and like internet and, I dunno, like social media, like there's so much in the outside world. Although you know what you say, it's just like.

[00:40:56] Jeanne de Kroon: How do I like, like let's first start before like, like, traveling across the world to, learn from all of these other incredible, cultures. Like, let's just learn, which flag is growing in this season? Like, how can I use it for healing? Like, or like how can I honor my own cycle in more deeper way?

[00:41:14] Jeanne de Kroon: Like, how can I relate to my mother or to my, to the people around me in like a softer way? How can I, and I think from that place, I feel like Al always, when we do the work, or like the activations in our own world, then the world invites us to share that in a bigger way through like the embodiment of that wisdom.

[00:41:35] Jeanne de Kroon: And I think that for me is like the really the practice. 'cause I think in the beginning, like of my journey of my twenties, I've spent, I feel like my entire twenties like running away, running towards stuff and. Whether this is like, I don't know, like, travels or boys or things or houses, I don't know.

[00:41:52] Jeanne de Kroon: It was just always very much looking for the next thing, and I think I really wanna have, like as the practice more for my thirties, is like just to really slow down, deeper into my own body. And my own heart and really come more from a place of, the heart and embodied wisdom and not so much from like the mind.

[00:42:12] Jeanne de Kroon: and I think that's also how we can really create like a more of an impact in the world in such a more strong way than just. Mimicking other people's stories or facts that are, some that, is just also another, a story, I think the most powerful, yeah, the most powerful transformation is like the embodiment of or learned wisdom through experience.

[00:42:37] Iris Josephina: Yeah. I resonate so much with everything. That you're saying. And I also love that you mentioned connecting through to our own cycles, our own cyclical bodies. And, to close off, I want to ask you a funny little bit of a funny question. Yeah. I like funny questions. I'm just very curious about your, like your choice of clothing, because I love.

[00:43:06] Iris Josephina: I know that you love adorning yourself with all the beautiful fabrics and the jewelry and just, I love the way that you express yourself through, fabrics and clothing and garments. And I'm curious how your choice of clothes shifts and changes throughout your menstrual cycle. Like, are you drawn to any type of clothing in a specific phase of your cycle?

[00:43:33] Jeanne de Kroon: Oh my God, yes. Like it really changes. Just all the things like, I don't know. this for me is definitely a thing, but not for everyone. I'm very much into it, like astrology and also into human design. But, I'm very much a Leo. I think I have like. Four or five Leo placements. So I'm, I love expression, like, expression is just like my favorite thing.

[00:43:56] Jeanne de Kroon: I've always, whenever I was like very young, five years old or six years old, I would like curate my whole outfits and put all the ribbons in my hair and like all the little, feathers I could find on the ground or like, like, would just make my own like outfits from the. From the, curtains that I would find at the charity shop.

[00:44:16] Jeanne de Kroon: so I've always just been very excited about expressing whatever was in me. And then I got really confused at some point with, I don't know, just like trends and things and black outfits in Berlin. And then now I feel like I really have my authentic style. And that's just, it really goes from like subcategories of, I don't know, I get really.

[00:44:36] Jeanne de Kroon: Excited about finding like antique French theater pieces from like the 18 and the 19 hundreds, which I then styled. I love like a, I love those like, with like, I dunno, just like an amazing, like vintage trouser that I found on the little market or, and then like I, so my style is really like, it's really me.

[00:44:56] Jeanne de Kroon: Like I, there's really no trend or no thought behind it. And then. The style that we create with Azzi is like, it's really a co-creation. So it's just what happens with when all these women, like both in my team here and the women there come together and they both start talking about their dreams and the colors and the things.

[00:45:13] Jeanne de Kroon: So also that doesn't really have like a style label. But anyways, cycle. Yes, very much I wear, so now I'm in my like premenstrual phase. I know that you have all of these really great names for it, but I don't know them by heart. But my premenstrual phase, I just feel like that's my really one time in the month where I'm not so expressive.

[00:45:33] Jeanne de Kroon: So I just wear my. Like, like darker colors. So I think my friends now know that like when I'm in brown or, like darker colors, like I'm like pre menstrual 'cause it's all, because otherwise this never happens. Like I just don't really wear black or brow. But when I'm like a few days before my period, like people know.

[00:45:53] Jeanne de Kroon: I in my like little bit invisible outfit, which for me is very rare. And then the moment that I have my, moon and like all of the, days afterwards, yeah, it just really goes like the moment I have my moon is actually great. It's like celebration. So then I would like to wear like reds and feel like, I dunno, I feel like a little bit of like a witchy lady.

[00:46:15] Jeanne de Kroon: So I like to wear like dresses and. And then underneath, maybe in the winter, like leggings and like little wooden socks, or in the summertime, just like long flowy dresses. And then, yeah. And then I think the phase after, what is it called again? You know these words? I

[00:46:30] Iris Josephina: dunno. So you have your menstrual phase and then your follicular phase, which is more like your inner spring.

[00:46:36] Iris Josephina: Yeah. And then your ovulation and then it's somewhere. And then your premenstrual is like luteal and autumn.

[00:46:42] Jeanne de Kroon: Luteal autumn. Yeah. So I know just like the follicular face. I'm, then like the cute little belly tops come out and like the low waist jeans and then I feel very cute and I am in more colors again.

[00:46:56] Jeanne de Kroon: And then I think, yeah, the ovulation phase is the same. I feel like they're a good like two and a half weeks of the month that I just feel like every morning I just want to. Just feel like a very sensual version of myself. I'm also going now through a little bit of like my own sensual and sexual liberation.

[00:47:13] Jeanne de Kroon: 'cause I feel like I've spent my entire, also like twenties, like dressing myself down because I was so afraid to be viewed as sensual or sexual. So I always would just like have a really cute smile and like I have a long dress on and be like, don't worry, I'm not. Intimidating or I'm not asking for anything.

[00:47:30] Jeanne de Kroon: And I think now I'm just like, no, like I'm, I wanna wear the short skirt and I'm even considering like a little belly piercing and I just, I'm going through my whole little new revolution of just embracing not that has anything to do with your central liberation, but just. Homecoming in my body where I feel like it's okay that my belly is seen or my legs are seen, or it's okay to, also be seen as a sexual being or a sexual woman that enjoys, the pleasure of existence itself and just yes, oh my God.

[00:48:04] Iris Josephina: Yes.

[00:48:09] Jeanne de Kroon: all of this. I was like, wow, like this is, for me, was such a big thing. Like I just, like, I was always a bit shy and I think now I'm just. I'm just, I feel like I'm just at the start also of like, also within my sexuality, I really notice like, wow, I don't know how old are you?

[00:48:25] Iris Josephina: I am going to be 33 in April, so I'm 32 now.

[00:48:30] Jeanne de Kroon: Amazing. So Ginger, so just feel like the moment you hit, you're almost in your thirties, you're just like, you just feel this like weight of your twenties and all of these stories that you've been told and like the wanting to be liked and approved of and like. Having to deal with all of these things and you're just coming into yourself and you're just like, wow.

[00:48:47] Jeanne de Kroon: There's such a spaciousness now. Yes. And relaxation.

[00:48:50] Iris Josephina: Yes. That's what your thirties are about.

[00:48:56] Jeanne de Kroon: I'm just so excited. I feel like I just came out of my second return and I just feel like I'm a whole new woman and I'm like, ready? Ready for both Spring in the outer world and like spring in my inner world and spring with all the outfits. All the friends and all the things. So yeah. Was that amazing answer to

[00:49:14] Iris Josephina: your

[00:49:15] Jeanne de Kroon: question?

[00:49:15] Iris Josephina: Yeah, I think so. Yeah, that answered my question perfectly, and I would love to end on this beautiful springy note, and I hope that everybody who listened to this is extremely inspired to go and find beautiful garments and beautiful clothes, and is also inspired to go back to their roots and their land.

[00:49:38] Iris Josephina: Take a deep dive into their own bodies and pleasure and sensuality and all the things. And, I'm also curious before we end, whether you could share where people can find you, should they want to learn more or check out, or all the beautiful garments that you create with Zazi. yeah,

[00:49:58] Jeanne de Kroon: definitely. So I have, my Instagram, which is Jeanne de Kroon and then I have the Zazi Instagram.

[00:50:03] Jeanne de Kroon: And I think for me, the really the most important thing is that it just inspires people, whether it's not your style or it's not your budget, but I think ultimately, like why I started it, it's just for people to feel inspired to. To wear something that is made with love, and you can really find this on every budget and every style.

[00:50:19] Jeanne de Kroon: So also when you're into like white linens, you have incredible, women's owned organizations that make really beautiful, more minimal white linen outfits or like, simple things or. But I th or like, thrift shopping or creating or mending. And I think this is really something that's been so inherent to women across the world.

[00:50:40] Jeanne de Kroon: It is something that is in our being to weave worlds together, to weave communities, and really bring life and creation into this world. yes. I think it just mostly like, what, like, yeah. I think I, I hope that I can inspire by my like, expression of life to reconnect to this incredible inherent beauty that we all carry.

[00:51:08] Iris Josephina: To me, you're definitely an inspiration in that exact way, so I can confirm. Yay. Thank you so much for coming on and making the time to share your story with us. It's been a pleasure. To talk to you. Thank you so much. Beautiful Iris, and

[00:51:28] Jeanne de Kroon: I'm really excited to connect me with your community soon.

[00:51:32] Iris Josephina: Okay, this wraps up today's episode.

[00:51:35] Iris Josephina: Thank you so much for listening. Want to know more about me? The best way to reach me is via At Cycles Seeds on Instagram. And if you heard something today and you think, oh my God, wow, I learned something new. Feel free to share the podcast on your social media and tag me or leave a review of rating. In this way, you help me reach more people like you.

[00:51:56] Iris Josephina: Thank you so much.

[00:51:57] I.

About the Host

I’m Iris Josephina:functional hormone specialist, orthomolecular hormone coach, and entrepreneur. Through Cycle Seeds and The Inner Rhythms Podcast, I support people in reconnecting with their cyclical nature, deepening body literacy, and reclaiming hormonal harmony from a place of sovereignty and embodied knowledge. Most people know me from Instagram, where I share stories, tools, and inspiration on cyclical living, menstrual cycles, fertility, hormones and more.

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